Here is the VIDEO re Karyn Folan's book: "Don't Bring Home a White Boy and Other Notions that Keep Black Women from Dating Out." Karyn's book will be released by Simon and Schuster in February 2010. Please plan to buy this book and help to get the word out about it.
http://myrealwedding.theknot.com/photo/view/Aesha & Natale's Wedding.
My Real Wedding from The Knot and The Nest.
Thanks, Steven for this link! For those of you who may not remember, Steven is a young wm who prefers WOC and wrote a few columns for the Ezine. He's quite handsome and personable (I've seen him and talked with him. He's actually a TV personality who some of you have seen.)
The young bw he was interested in when he initially wrote to me was very "skittish" in her behavior towards him. He asked me for advice because she did a lot of ducking, dodging, and acting strange around him. He later told me at one point that he'd probably have to move on from her because he'd shown her he was interested by spending time with her, helping her in various ways because he liked being with her. LOL! He said she seemed to be overly concerned about how the other blacks in her environment would view a relationship with him.It would be interesting to know what her romantic life is like and what it will be like in the future. She's just a typical bw who's WAITING for permission from the bc to love and be loved by a non-AA man--permission that she'll never get. I certainly don't hear any AAs openly telling or encouraging an AA woman to go and be with or marry a loving and loveable wm and be his love. LOL! I'm not saying none of them do it, but if it's done, it's mainly done in whispers on the DL.
Even though 14% of AA men marry non-bw (according to a recent NEWSWEEK magazine article) and a gazillion AA men cohabit with non-black women or exclusively date non-black women or are not available due to other reasons, the typical AA person doesn't think in terms of numbers. They think magically or EMOTIONALLY that there are still ***plenty*** LOL! of "good" bm available for all of us AA women (despite the fact that many AA women don't have anything in common with a typical bm or don't have any particular preference for or leaning towards a bm). People who actually believe that obviously do believe that 2+2 = 22 because it's a type of "emotional" arithmetic or magical thinking.
Also, the vast majority of these folks think that bw should not only choose an AA man FIRST, but to them, he can virtually be "any" kind of AA man. ANY kind. Sadly, this young woman has never been taught (because who is there around her who'd teach her?) that Quality is the #1 criteria and that skin shade is of minor, if any, importance.
So Steven, you did say to me that you'd begin looking in another ethnic group of WOC--since this wasn't the first time this has happened--for a woman who doesn't need to get permission to accept a loving man in her life. So maybe by now, you've found your 'Miss Right.' Hope so.
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ENTRY:
Secondly, so many of you have asked me to write about the topic of VETTING men, so consider this essay re vetting to be my holiday gift to those of you. LOL! As usual, please do what I always advise: Take what you can use and trash the rest.
However this particular note from a commenter enabled me to segue right into the topic of vetting and highlights the value of getting timely advice that speaks specifically to your situation. I can easily advise those women who can understand my common sense language. I can't do beans for those women who don't understand my common sense views. Thankfully, there are other voices out there for them.
Hey Evia:
I wrote to you about a year ago about my dilemma regarding an uneducated, poverty struck black man who had a great personality and loved me to pieces. Normally, I wouldn't have even entertained a conversation with a man of his caliber but because I had known him since childhood (we had a teenage love affair) and he was a dear family friend, my mind started to wonder towards the possibility of a fruitful union. THANK GOD I wrote to you about the situation. You and your readers let me have it. I totally became grounded and shortly thereafter said goodbye to that love affair. I've since started dating a very cute/nice Jewish guy who completes in PHD in Clinical Psychology in May 2010 (I'm an attorney). Its still fairly early in the relationship, but I thought I'd share the good news of progress. Although we don't share the same history as my previous suitor, I can actually see a future with this guy that doesn't include me lowering my standards in the name of love, or more accurately at times, the imitation thereof.
Keep preaching the good word, it surely has helped me and is helping me help others because AA women truly have been brainwashed and we have to deprogram ourselves and each other.
Thanks!
P.S. I want to add that my previous suitor was, and still is, a great guy and didn't do anything wrong, now or then, but at the end of the day, I need to protect and preserve my present and future happiness and well being and entering a relationship where I would have to be the main or sole bread winner and stifle my social growth to accommodate my mate (i.e. not attending certain events or not socializing with certain people because he didn't fit in or feel comfortable) just didn't seem conducive to my happiness and well being.
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I'm happy to hear about you and your guy! Sounds like he's a keeper! Yeah, I remember how everybody and their grandmama weighed in on your case. We said, 'she jes crazy.' LOL!
And I'm happy that you said that you saw the good in your bm ex-boyfriend. He just wasn't suitable for you. He may be suitable for someone who is more like himself. I don't quite understand why some AA men who are at his station in life seem to feel that they are 'equally yoked' with a professional bw. Many AA men are apparently trying to practice hypergamy or to "marry up." Hypergamy is the traditional behavior or standard operating procedure of ALL women throughout the world and has been for thousands of years.
So many AA males will claim that they're just looking for physically appealing women, but the fact is that there are good looking women on ALL socioeconomic levels. Why is it that so many of these males seem to gravitate towards higher strata bw and think they "deserve" y'all, and get furious at you when you reject them? I'm not saying your ex did this, but don't these AA males realize that hypergamy is what women do, NOT men. Men traditionally want women who bring less money than they do because the fact is that the person who brings in substantially more money is the one who has the most POWER. There are exceptions, but exceptions don't disprove rules. This is just how it is in a patriarchal world. So, when a man or a woman tries to be a man sometimes and a woman at other times, 'things fall apart.' Thanks, Chinua Achebe. LOL!
I've begged AA women who have been pushed all too often into the role of major breadwinner to STOP using your money to pay the lion's share of the bills. Just do NOT do it! MOST men won't really appreciate it if you do and will actually resent you on some level because he knows that more money = more power because you can use money to acquire more choices. Choices often equates to power. If more money didn't equal more power and more choices, then people wouldn't even care much about getting more money. If you're a woman who makes substantially more money than your mate, I would advise you to chip in and pay some of the bills, IF you and he want that, but don't pay the major portion of the bills, aside from special circumstances. It would be far, far better to adjust your standard of living to one where you both can chip in equally or where he can pay most of the bills. A typical man will get more respect from a woman this way than if he marries up and allows her to pay most of the bills--even if she insists on paying more. This may be why some bm do marry down and feel intimidated by women who make more money.
I've noted that this pattern of AA male hypergamy is a pattern these days among AAs. It doesn't happen in all cases, but there's a certain amount of predictability, so that means it's a pattern. I've also noted that when these males mate and marry non-bw, they tend to mate and marry "down," (hypogamy) but as I said, when they pursue a typical AA woman, they tend to want her to be loaded with education, good employment, childless, good looking, physically fit, congenial, willing to cook and clean AND willing to sex them any way they want when they want it. And even that doesn't mean they'll remain faithful. Many of them still pursue their "extracurricular" activities. Whew!
I've also noted that many AA men "claim" they don't care about a bw's education but you don't see them pursuing or engaging with bw who are high school dropouts or barely skilled black women. NOT black women.
This is why I say to bw to stop falling for the same-ole okey doke! At least, make these men scramble and come up with a new game! LOL!
I don't think that some bm are DBR or straight up “bad.” I think that some of them (like your ex) are just clueless and don't seem to know what to do because they haven't had adequate role models. Many of them are not even trying to learn what to do either. There is NOTHING stopping AA men from furthering their education or learning marketable skills or both or upgrading themselves in other ways. NOTHING. Aside from being clueless, the bulk of these males lack DRIVE and they accuse bw of being "too demanding" if the woman dares to says anything to them about these deficits.
So, the bottom line is still the same--when it comes to being mate and father material. A clueless man and/or one who lacks DRIVE is not worth a woman's time, no matter how nice he is and no matter whether he loves her. That is, unless the woman has decided from the outset that she's going to be his meal ticket. It is her choice to be his meal ticket, but what happens is that so many AA women enter these relationships thinking that he is going to 'change' because he TOLD her he is going to change. LOL! SMH
An AA woman, especially, cannot afford to be with a clueless man! Maybe some among other groups of women can afford a clueless man because there may be a safety net to catch them and their children from such unions, but it's obvious that an AA woman does not have that net in place.
Another thing is that a lot of black folks try to make the case that a blue-collar bm is fine as a mate for a professional bw. Yes, in a minority of cases, this may be true because SOME women with advanced or professional degrees have plain interests and some are really what I'll call "low-brow" in their social habits and interests. And some blue collar men are very much socially exposed, travel a lot, are comfortable in a variety of settings, and read widely. So some couples like that are exceptions. I think that I'll try to write more or actually I'm planning podcasts about more of the nuances of relationship suitability/compatibility. Many folks shy away from the topic because it sounds snobbish, but the fact is that, there is such a thing as "class" and class counts!I’ve put off writing about VETTING because it’s a topic that can be both complex and simple, but mainly uncomfortable because I knew I would have to delve into the bugaboo issue of “class.” I noticed a long time ago that whenever you try to talk to AAs about class differences between blacks, it infuriates them. I’ve never quite understood why because we all do come from a “class.” There have always been class distinctions in many societies and civilizations even though they may not use the term “class.”
I’ve pointed out here that I grew up in a rural, cash-poor, working class farm family that instilled middle class values and upwardly mobile sensibilities in me, which include delaying gratification, behaving with decorum at all times, especially in public, high value placed on education, strong work ethic, choosing a quality man for marriage and that I must marry before having children, handling money wisely, getting along with others (and if I can’t get along with them, then separate myself from them because uncouth behavior is not allowed), general decency and morality, husband and I must teach our children to behave well and be responsible members of the community, etc.
Insofar as being a female, I am naturally soft-spoken (and used to smile a lot before I moved to a large urban area where my smile was often interpreted as "come and get some" by typical negro men) but was taught to be demure with men and to avoid uncouth males/men and those who lack drive, purpose, and respect for women. These are just some of the values and views from the “old-school” type upbringing that I received. (Keep in mind that all old-school thinking is not exactly the same; it can vary somewhat by region, time, class, etc.) There are a bunch of other values and views that were a part of my formative years, but you get the idea. I later came to realize that these values fall under what’s commonly known as “middle-class” values.
I remember talking to my Nigerian ex-husband about the issue of class and he said he just assumed that all AAs were in the same class because all Nigerians are in the same class. He pointed out that the values I mentioned above are the common ones that all Nigerians (rich and poor) are instilled with as a part of their general culture. I saw his point. He said he thought all AA had these same values. He said that by default, that’s how a typical African (who’s raised in Africa) would view all AAs and expect for them to behave. He thought I was being divisive therefore by bringing up the issue of class differences.I told him that via my background in ethnology (comparative cultures), I’d learned that most people in the world have these middle of the road “common” sense values and maybe this is why they’re called “MIDDLE-class” values. I pointed out to him that all AAs are definitely not in the same class because many AAs are very different from other AAs in their VALUES, beliefs, behavior, attitudes, views regarding themselves and other AAs and regarding other people in the world.
I pointed out to him that whereas the vast majority of Nigerians are homogeneous when it comes to basic beliefs and values regarding marriage & family (the basic building block of any society or group or civilization), some segments of AAs think vastly different about just about every issue under the heading of family and etc. It shocked him when I pointed out that many AAs (men, in particular these days) don’t even see the point in getting married, for ex. but what really rendered him speechless was when I told him that many AA men don’t even see the connection between themselves and their children and that many of them don't behave with any obligation towards their children or get furious about being forced to financially support their own children! (Not saying that ALL AA men are deadbeat dads.)
My ex was not able to wrap his brain around that at all, because even the most downtrodden and even the most gentle, typical Nigerian man is often capable of doing serious harm to anyone who tries to separate him or break the bond between him and his children. (Not saying absolutely ALL Nigerian men are like this, so please don't write to tell me that you hunted and pecked around and found a Nigerian man who didn't support his children.)
As an aside, as an AA woman, I LOVED that about African culture and about African men because I knew that even if my relationship went south with a typical African guy, he, in all probability, would always safeguard any child(ren) that we had.
I’ve introduced the topic of vetting in this way because it is paramount to understand who you are, who he is, what your backgrounds are, what each partner’s VALUES are, what each is bringing to the relationship table. RULE: Each of you must pretty much bring the same amount in terms of EQUIVALENT assets to the table. For best results, the man and woman don’t have to have the same assets, but they have to be Equivalent, Equivalent, Equivalent, as viewed by the partners--not necessarily by other people. There are exceptions to every rule, but this is a critical rule. If each partner doesn’t bring approximately EQUIVALENT assets to the table, at some point one or the other of them is going to feel that s/he is being shortchanged. Resentment sets in and things go south.For ex., I've heard people criticize Tiger Woods and OJ for choosing to marry a nanny and a waitress, respectively. Obviously, these men thought their blond wives were bringing equivalent assets (white and blondness) equal to the wealth and prominence the men brought to the table. Obviously, in both of these cases, one partner, at least, felt shortchanged and tried to make up the difference. Things went south.
Another very common example is when a younger woman trades her youth and beauty to an older man for his money and the security he provides, i.e. Rupert Murdoch and his much younger Asian wife, Larry King and his much younger wife, and Paul McCartney and his younger wife.
As long as both partners are satisfied with the trade, things are fine, but when one or both of them begins to feel that the other one didn't bring enough, there is a very real problem at hand.
This is why I advised you as I did. From what you told me, I did not see where the guy you were seeing was bringing an equivalent amount of relationship assets to the table. I believe that many AA women “settle” for a man of the type you described or try to talk themselves into "settling" (because I get a bunch of notes asking the SAME type of question you did), but later begin to feel shortchanged and that’s when things get ugly. At that point, they’ve usually had a child(ren) and the child becomes the victim when the parents split, and the woman is left struggling alone with the child(ren). This is a very common pattern.By relationship assets, I definitely don’t mean just money. I mean TOTAL relationship assets. But let’s be real about money. Money alone does NOT make a good relationship, but if a man doesn’t bring enough money to the table, that can and does often kill a relationship. By relationship assets in general, I’m talking about a man bringing things to the table that include but are not limited to: DRIVE (very, very important) character (morality, principles, self-control), marketable skills and/or education that PRODUCE ****enough**** money, common sense, good judgment, strong family-emphasis/values, money sense, fair amount of relational skills (which include the ability to say “I’m sorry” or “I was wrong to . . . .”), intellect, general survivability skills, capacity and desire to grow and develop, respectful, loving nature and displays it towards the woman, fatherhood desire and the emotional and financial preparation to meet the demands of fatherhood. IMO, these are necessities. I cannot see a woman like me—with MY values--being with a man who doesn’t at least bring these “relationship assets” to my table. IMO, this is what a woman (from my segment) should be primarily looking for. If the man has the above and is good-looking with a buffed body, that’s the icing. However, I personally have never thought much about the icing. It just so happens that in both of my marriages, I definitely got the cake AND enough of the icing to satisfy me. LOL!
I’ve had people tell me that it’s "insane" and unrealistic for an AA woman to have criteria like mine and that I’m “LUCKY” to have found husbands like mine. I point out that there are plenty of men in the global village who easily meet and exceed my criteria and I knew that some of those men would appreciate what I bring to the table. Therefore, it’s insane for a woman from my segment to settle for less than my criteria.
Surprise! Surprise! There are different SEGMENTS of AA women. LOL! Many people (even many AAs) think that ALL AA women are the same or almost the same. We are NOT. There are different segments of us because we’ve had very different backgrounds and experiences. That's mostly what causes people to be different.
My voice represents and/or resonates with ONE segment or "class" of us AA women and it’s a substantial segment. This is clear to me because I’ve heard from so many of you who hear and speak my language. Many people, however, have difficulty understanding our language and accepting our existence because they’re influenced by the AA woman who they often view in the media. They’re thinking about either the “Mammy,” the “Sapphire,” or the “Jezebel” or a combo of one or more of those stereotypes of AA women from the ole plantation. Sadly, these characters are still with us because I see AA women still acting like caricatures out of these stereotypes since they get their marching orders from the black and white media and other blacks who are lost. I wrote extensively in my essays about these stereotypes a couple of years ago. Suffice it to say that many people (even many AAs) do not believe that there are AA women like me, who even exist, and will accuse a bw with my values of trying to be "white." LOL!
It's just a fact of AA life these days that when an AA person acts "normal," we're accused of acting "white" by other AAs who I call the "acting black crew" (ABCs). These ABCs have no idea that THEY are the ones who are lost and are not acting "normal." LOL! However, even Africans are accused by the ABCs of not being black and acting "white." To a typical ABC person, they are the only "black" people on earth. They feel that the rest of us are imposters. LOL!!!!! So sad that they grabbed a label that's the opposite of "white" and wrapped themselves in it and are now behaving in a way that I'm sure makes white racists drool with joy.
A lot of "old school" black folks like me can hide in plain sight around other AAs because so few younger blacks, especially, are even aware that we exist--unless we let something slip. LOL!
So, you see, it might be insane for a Mammy, a Sapphire, or a Jezebel, to have my vetting criteria, but since there are plenty of us AA women who are neither of those, we are able to have criteria such as mine and meet men who meet the criteria with us being quite average women--if we don't limit ourselves. Women have married men from around the globe for thousands of years. This is nothing new. It's just new and scarey to some AAs because it's a fact that AAs travel less and mingle less outside their group than any other ethnic or racial group in this part of the world. That's just a fact. So it doesn't take much talk about mingling with or marrying whites or other non-AAs to get a typical AA upset because this is something fearful to them because it's outside of their experience or outside of what they think is "normal."
Let me briefly mention that I was talking with a bw friend of mine yesterday about this topic and she said that among another segment of AA women is the notion of just “getting a man” so that the woman won’t have to be alone. She pointed out that the criteria of these women is nothing like mine.
I’m not knocking that view because that obviously has come about for a reason, but I absolutely cannot relate to that view. That’s ANOTHER segment of AA women and there are, of course, other segments of AA women. However, my message is NOT aimed at that segment of women. That’s another language. I’m sure they have their reasons for thinking the way they do, just like I have my reasons for thinking the way I do, but I will never be able to relate to that viewpoint, and they may never be able to relate to mine. But at the end of the day, it's okay. As long as each segment is satisfied with the men they choose, then that's what matters because as long as you understand and accept that your choices have consequences, then you will realize that your choices determine the quality of your life.
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